Call Day Advice - 2L Recruitment

[WesternLaw543 14]

Hi all,

I wanted to start a thread relating to advice for call day which is coming up next week, along with a couple of my own questions. 

• How much does interview time matter given that it is on the first day? For example, would it be permissible to schedule a firm lower on my list in the 8 a.m. slot as a "warm up", or is that a prime spot that would be better used for a high choice?
• Is there any way to determine which firm is calling you ?

Please feel free to suggest any other advice, or elaborate on personal experiences that may prove useful.

Thanks.

[123law30 9]

In response to your questions:

1. I wouldn't use the 8am slot as a warm up - at least in the Toronto market, that spot tends to indicate interest, so I would put a firm that you are interested in at 8am. 
2. From what I remember, most come up as "No Caller ID", but what you can do is look at the first three digits of a firm's phone number (they tend to all be the same firm wide, i.e. BLG will all be 416-123-XXXX) so that may help you figure out which firm is calling. The issue is that a lot of the time because of the number of calls they have to make, people call from a personal phone and block the number! 

Some other advice: 

1. Email all the firms you do not plan on interviewing with during in firms and let them know you do not plan on accepting an interview. The only firms that should call you on call day are the ones you want to accept (or the ones you don't know are coming as not all firms send ITC emails). If you know you are going to turn down an offer for an interview, all that call will do on call day is make your morning even crazier, which isn't worth it. 
2. Make a mock schedule, and don't be afraid to suggest a time that is different from the time they propose to you when they call. If you have a firm you want as 8am, and a different firm asks about 8am, don't just say yes. You can ask for a different time. 
3. While you should push back a little (politely) and try and stick to your plan, it is also normal for your day to turn out looking completely different from what you wanted, so you need to be prepared for that possibility as well. 

[WesternLaw543 14]

3 minutes ago, 123law30 said:

In response to your questions:

1. I wouldn't use the 8am slot as a warm up - at least in the Toronto market, that spot tends to indicate interest, so I would put a firm that you are interested in at 8am. 
2. From what I remember, most come up as "No Caller ID", but what you can do is look at the first three digits of a firm's phone number (they tend to all be the same firm wide, i.e. BLG will all be 416-123-XXXX) so that may help you figure out which firm is calling. The issue is that a lot of the time because of the number of calls they have to make, people call from a personal phone and block the number! 

Some other advice: 

1. Email all the firms you do not plan on interviewing with during in firms and let them know you do not plan on accepting an interview. The only firms that should call you on call day are the ones you want to accept (or the ones you don't know are coming as not all firms send ITC emails). If you know you are going to turn down an offer for an interview, all that call will do on call day is make your morning even crazier, which isn't worth it. 
2. Make a mock schedule, and don't be afraid to suggest a time that is different from the time they propose to you when they call. If you have a firm you want as 8am, and a different firm asks about 8am, don't just say yes. You can ask for a different time. 
3. While you should push back a little (politely) and try and stick to your plan, it is also normal for your day to turn out looking completely different from what you wanted, so you need to be prepared for that possibility as well. 

All very helpful and great advice! Thank you.

[catgirl2022 27]

I was curious as to whether we should be prepared for surprise calls from firms that did not send you an ITC and how to handle that 

[Rashabon 3240]

36 minutes ago, WesternLaw543 said:

Hi all,

I wanted to start a thread relating to advice for call day which is coming up next week, along with a couple of my own questions. 

• How much does interview time matter given that it is on the first day? For example, would it be permissible to schedule a firm lower on my list in the 8 a.m. slot as a "warm up", or is that a prime spot that would be better used for a high choice?
• Is there any way to determine which firm is calling you ?

Please feel free to suggest any other advice, or elaborate on personal experiences that may prove useful.

Thanks.

Anything on the first day is fine. I think your idea of a warm up slot for 8 am is not bad. 10 am for me is the sweet spot.

EDIT: Just to build on this - interviewers and lawyers are humans too. I'm not a morning person, some people are. Plenty of people are going through their first coffee and still waking up from 8 to 9, especially now that you don't need to wake up early to get to the office. While you should expect the same level of professionalism as any other time of day, reality is, some people will definitely be tired if they are interviewing at 8 am as compared to 10. And that goes for you as an interviewee.

Scheduling your top choice at 8 am to "show interest" but then bombing an interview because you're still half asleep is definitely the wrong choice.

Edited February 18 by Rashabon

[cherrytree 296]

If you are not a pumped-and-energetic-and-ready-to-work-the-room type of person at 8am, do not schedule your top firm at 8am purely to "signal interest". Later in the morning or early afternoon on the first day would be just as fine. Also, at 8am, you would have met only one firm and not have had other in-firm experiences for comparison yet, so using strong absolutist language to convey interest is unlikely to come across as very sincere to your 8am firm.

[123law30 9]

17 minutes ago, cherrytree said:

Also, at 8am, you would have met only one firm and not have had other in-firm experiences for comparison yet, so using strong absolutist language to convey interest is unlikely to come across as very sincere to your 8am firm.

For the record - definitely agree that during the actual in firm you shouldn't use "first choice" type language before you've met with any other firms. I was simply referring to when an interview should be booked, not how you should convey interest during the interview. I would wait until you've met with everyone before you use that type of language in an interview because it will come across insincere. 

Thing with booking is that there is a certain amount of politics involved. I am not suggesting you can't get hired at a firm unless you put them at 8am - that is definitely not the case. I am the FURTHEST thing from a morning person and I still put my first choice at 8am, because the fact is that slot does mean something (as much as I think the politics are ridiculous). To each their own, and people could argue about that 8am slot all day (and honestly there is definitely not one right take on it), but unless you know for a fact you will be half asleep during that time slot, might as well but your first choice there and not risk having the politics work against you! 

[1993aj 5]

Is it worth scheduling interviews with five employers if the first interview for one employer will have to fall on the second day? In other words, will scheduling an employer on the second day signal lower priority such that it isn't worth scheduling at all? For the record, I'm extremely interested in all five.

[easttowest 1779]

7 minutes ago, 1993aj said:

Is it worth scheduling interviews with five employers if the first interview for one employer will have to fall on the second day? In other words, will scheduling an employer on the second day signal lower priority such that it isn't worth scheduling at all? For the record, I'm extremely interested in all five.

If they call you last and you don’t have any room left it is what it is. You can tell them your schedule is full and ask if there is a first day evening event you can attend to signal your interest. 

Yes, your interest will seem lower, but people get hired from a first interview on day two. It’s definitely not worth scrapping the interview altogether. 

[1993aj 5]

Just now, easttowest said:

If they call you last and you don’t have any room left it is what it is. You can tell them your schedule is full and ask if there is a first day evening event you can attend to signal your interest. 

Yes, your interest will seem lower, but people get hired from a first interview on day two. It’s definitely not worth scrapping the interview altogether. 

Thank you, that's great advice! I like the idea of attending a first day evening event in order to signal interest.

Much appreciated!

[hahaohoh 0]

what types of evening events can we expect?

[Rashabon 3240]

23 hours ago, 123law30 said:

For the record - definitely agree that during the actual in firm you shouldn't use "first choice" type language before you've met with any other firms. I was simply referring to when an interview should be booked, not how you should convey interest during the interview. I would wait until you've met with everyone before you use that type of language in an interview because it will come across insincere. 

Thing with booking is that there is a certain amount of politics involved. I am not suggesting you can't get hired at a firm unless you put them at 8am - that is definitely not the case. I am the FURTHEST thing from a morning person and I still put my first choice at 8am, because the fact is that slot does mean something (as much as I think the politics are ridiculous). To each their own, and people could argue about that 8am slot all day (and honestly there is definitely not one right take on it), but unless you know for a fact you will be half asleep during that time slot, might as well but your first choice there and not risk having the politics work against you! 

I don't agree and I don't think there's a single firm that assesses 8 am vs. 10 am when it comes down to deciding how their candidates rank. That's absurd. Tuesday vs. Monday, or end of Monday vs. Monday morning, sure, maybe. But within the first three slots of the day? Absolutely all the same.

[stephcurry 24]

How many first interviews are "too many"? Like would 6 on day 1 and 1 first thing in the morning the second day be acceptable? 

[JohnStuartHobbes 204]

25 minutes ago, stephcurry said:

How many first interviews are "too many"? Like would 6 on day 1 and 1 first thing in the morning the second day be acceptable? 

I doubt you’ll be able to physically set up that schedule but if you can, do it. I just think it’s next to impossible. 

[easttowest 1779]

21 minutes ago, stephcurry said:

How many first interviews are "too many"? Like would 6 on day 1 and 1 first thing in the morning the second day be acceptable? 

I’m not sure how you’d schedule 6. The firms don’t have uniform time slots and you likely won’t be able to schedule back-to-back-to-back. 

Assume each interview is 1.5 hours. Yes, you could theoretically schedule 8, 9:30, 11, 12:30, 2, 3:30. However, some firms don’t offer start times on the half hour. Most firms break for lunch around 12-1. Some firms don’t schedule for 8am. The odds of it lining up for you to schedule 6 are, I think, non-existent, and even if you pulled it off you’d be in front of your screen with no breaks from 8-5.

[Rare92 5]

Do government employers (specifically the DOJ in Toronto) care if you schedule their interview on the second day instead of the first?

[123law30 9]

2 hours ago, Rashabon said:

I don't agree and I don't think there's a single firm that assesses 8 am vs. 10 am when it comes down to deciding how their candidates rank. That's absurd. Tuesday vs. Monday, or end of Monday vs. Monday morning, sure, maybe. But within the first three slots of the day? Absolutely all the same.

Yes that was my exact point on this - everyone has their own opinion, and its unlikely one is right while the rest are wrong. It's also likely not universal between firms. I happen to have been told from a few people who do recruiting at large Toronto firms that they use whether or not candidates ask for an 8am as an indication of interest. Again, not necessarily universal, and absolutely not the only measure of interest, but my opinion based on my experience, and what I had been told, is it makes a difference. 

[123law30 9]

32 minutes ago, stephcurry said:

How many first interviews are "too many"? Like would 6 on day 1 and 1 first thing in the morning the second day be acceptable? 

I managed 5 interviews all on the first day and thats probably the cap, because they all needed to be booked for 2 hours and then there were evening events. It was a lot but 5 is definitely doable. Just keep in mind it does mean you will be interviewing for 10 hours straight with very short (if any) break in between. 

[stephcurry 24]

50 minutes ago, easttowest said:

I’m not sure how you’d schedule 6. The firms don’t have uniform time slots and you likely won’t be able to schedule back-to-back-to-back. 

Assume each interview is 1.5 hours. Yes, you could theoretically schedule 8, 9:30, 11, 12:30, 2, 3:30. However, some firms don’t offer start times on the half hour. Most firms break for lunch around 12-1. Some firms don’t schedule for 8am. The odds of it lining up for you to schedule 6 are, I think, non-existent, and even if you pulled it off you’d be in front of your screen with no breaks from 8-5.

some interviews are actually 30 min this year! So kinda hoping that might help but probably still not a good idea ... thank you!

[law202021 4]

14 minutes ago, stephcurry said:

some interviews are actually 30 min this year! So kinda hoping that might help but probably still not a good idea ... thank you!

Which firms are doing 30 min interviews? I was told to schedule every firm for at least 90 min.