Jump to content
BalChris

Unpaid Articling

Recommended Posts

On 11/10/2020 at 11:48 PM, castlepie said:

This exists??

Yes, it does. 

On 11/11/2020 at 1:08 AM, Diplock said:

People have taken unpaid articling positions before. It's obviously viewed as sort of a desperation move of last resort, but I'll spare you the five additional paragraphs and cut to the point of your question.

This is why, generally. 

I know of students who have come up with "interesting" arrangements. For example, being laid off from a previous employer and agreeing to, effectively, volunteer for a lawyer as an articled clerk while collecting employment insurance (to ensure there is some source of income without eating into LOCs). The requirement under E.I. is that the person is continuing to apply for paid positions. Other arrangements I'm aware of include billable target kickbacks, or "bonuses" for business the clerk may bring in. In these scenarios, the firms almost always cover bar course and admission fees. 

Edited by Phaedrus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, SNAILS said:

I'm not sure if this is relevant to your question or not.

When I taught at an Ontario college, students graduating from the Power Engineering program required a certain amount of practical experience before they could be certified as fourth class engineers by the TSSA. (We commonly referred to this as the three months of required practical "steam" time). 

The big question for students was always, "Should I accept an unpaid co-op?"

Now, if you were a high achieving student, you would get a well paid co-op regardless.

If you were willing to travel (usually north or west), you would get a well paid co-op even if you were just an average student.

If you were a low achieving student, you could stay in the local area (and keep living with your parents, etc), and take on an unpaid co-op, get certified, and then explore your career options.  

The companies that offered unpaid co-ops were generally very easy on their "interns" (which is not actually what anyone called them, but it works for illustrative purposes). They did not work them too hard, though they were expected to do some productive work. It was generally a good learning experience for the students. 

Based on this, my view of an unpaid articling position is not quite as negative as some other posters here seem to have.

Myself, I would not take on unpaid articling, but I would agree to a (relatively) low hourly rate if it was my best avenue to get called to the bar. 

I'm not sure I think an 8-12 month articling experience (depending on jurisdiction and other things), with professional licensing dues, is equivalent to a three month unpaid "steam" time, particularly since I'm guessing most people graduating from your college program are ~19-20 as opposed to, at a minimum, 25-26, but that's just a hunch.

Edited by Pyke
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Ptolemy said:

Unpaid articling in Alberta is illegal.  Articling students are entitled to minimum wage.  The LSA emailed a notice to the profession earlier this year confirming such.  

Great, and I hope every law society follows suit. 
 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Pyke said:

I'm not sure I think an 8-12 month articling experience (depending on jurisdiction and other things), with professional licensing dues, is equivalent to a three month unpaid "steam" time, particularly since I'm guessing most people graduating from your college program are ~19-20 as opposed to, at a minimum, 25-26, but that's just a hunch.

Equivalent, no.

But it supports the idea that unpaid people in an apprentice or intern type role are more likely to be viewed as someone who is there to learn (while doing some work) as opposed to someone who has to do long hours of grunt work.

The evidence of whether what I am saying is true or not would lie in the specific case where such an unpaid position is offered. The applicant could ask what hours or work are expected, what duties are expected, etc.

I'm going to refer back to what Diplock said about a "desperation move." It may come down to a choice of not getting accredited as a lawyer or taking this route.

Another quick point I will make relates to Ryerson's integrated practice curriculum - or whatever it's called when you don;t have to do the articling year. (Look it up if you don't know what I am talking about). This itself shows evidence of a lack of readily available, well paid articling positions. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.


  • Recent Posts

    • Thanks all! I chose the Victoria firm. Very happy with it 🙂.
    • I'm starting this topic for students who have been admitted to the GPLLM programme. Hope to get to know some of you before the start of the semester! 
    • I've got similar stats but have zero clue either, but good luck, I'm rooting for you! Will follow thread in case anyone can help chance us 
    • You could totally see it as a crappy way to find out that your chances might not be in your favour. I'm more of the foolish optimist that would take it as a helpful early sign for you to realign your hopes for the U of A. I totally agree that you should check the previously admitted scores and see where you are and gauge accordingly. Waiting anxiously is really exhausting, especially when you don't know when you're going to hear back. Good on you for applying broadly, so many universities are sending out their offers later in the year. It's literally out of your hands and because we can't control it, it can bring on this helpless feeling. I went through a rejection year and while I was worried waiting, I went ahead and slowly planned for each outcome. I was graduating during COVID so I remade my resume, took a public speaking course, made a list of all the shows I was going to binge, reflected whether my current volunteer and work was relevant in law, etc. Then I got rejected, shamelessly gave myself time to ball my eyes out and then started on with my plan. It really helped knowing there was something I was ready to do right after being rejected. Really put me in perspective and when I applied this year, you bet I did the same thing. Not saying that this will happen, of course, I hope you kick ass under the holistic section! Just thought it might be worth to share as it definitely helped me be more calm during these uneasy times.      

×
×
  • Create New...