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Throwaway999

Just started an associate position and hating it

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Sadly, I have heard similar stories more times than I would like. There are some real nut jobs in this profession. Get out ASAP. We are all rooting for you!

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Leave - plain and simple. Find a job to pay bills and build your own practice or find another associate position. It baffles me why so many lawyers/law students felt obliged to remain in a toxic environment and think it's the end of the world if they leave. 

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PS - Saying this as someone who worked in a toxic legal environment for exactly one day, left for the evening, thought about it, and never went back the next day. Didn't think twice even though I needed to complete my articles. Ended up a great firm within a few weeks.

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On 12/29/2019 at 2:33 AM, godsplan said:

Leave - plain and simple. 

This.

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Posted (edited)

If what you said about  her daughter's homework is true, you should gather all the evidence and report to the law society.

Edited by abcsucker

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, abcsucker said:

If what you said about  her daughter's homework is true, you should gather all the evidence and report to the law society.

I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess you’re not a practising lawyer. 

Not legal advice, but I would memo all the surrounding facts, then GTFO and file the memo if needed in the future. 

Edited by QuincyWagstaff

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Update for you guys: I quit without having a job lined up. Ever day there was just so draining that it prevented me from dedicating much energy to job hunting or to setting up on my own. I gave two-weeks notice and worked hard until the end. I noticed that things improved quite a bit after I gave notice, but I thought the improvement was akin to leaving an abusive relationship, where they improve after you threaten to leave, only to revert back to their old selves after some time. 

Question for you guys: I have an interview with a local lawyer who knows my former boss pretty well -- not sure if they are on perfect terms. How do I explain what happened? How much should I divulge? 

If I apply to places out of my city, is it OK to just say I was shadowing lawyers who couldn't give me employment? 

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Just now, Throwaway999 said:

If I apply to places out of my city, is it OK to just say I was shadowing lawyers who couldn't give me employment? 

No, as a licensee you can't tell these kinds of lies anymore.

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51 minutes ago, Throwaway999 said:

Update for you guys: I quit without having a job lined up. Ever day there was just so draining that it prevented me from dedicating much energy to job hunting or to setting up on my own. I gave two-weeks notice and worked hard until the end. I noticed that things improved quite a bit after I gave notice, but I thought the improvement was akin to leaving an abusive relationship, where they improve after you threaten to leave, only to revert back to their old selves after some time. 

Question for you guys: I have an interview with a local lawyer who knows my former boss pretty well -- not sure if they are on perfect terms. How do I explain what happened? How much should I divulge? 

If I apply to places out of my city, is it OK to just say I was shadowing lawyers who couldn't give me employment? 

Just tell the lawyer you don't see eye to eye. Do not mention what happened. 

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Be honest but diplomatic. Definitely do not start talking smack about your old boss. It'll just make you sound petty and unprofessional. 

 

Something along the lines of "I really appreciated the opportunity, but the nature of the work was different than what I was expecting." Or "we decided to go our separate ways." Something short sweet and move on. 

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If she was as you say she was - the new employer will know about it.

It is a remarkably small and gossipy profession.  The lawyers talk, the assistants talk - for a profession with so many secretes - who is or is not a giant asshole is usually not one of them.

So just be honest, you didn't get along and you want a), b) and c) in your new position so is that something the new firm can provide?

 

 

Edited by Rumpy
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I quit my associate position because -- among other things -- I found the partner for whom I did the majority of my work very difficult to work with. Other partners and associates tended to avoid working with that partner for just that reason, but tended to turn a blind eye because he had a significant book of business. He was known for having a lot of juniors quit on him.

Everyone knew why I quit at my former firm without me having to say anything negative about anyone, whether in-person or at the exit interview. If you think that your manager was difficult, and you are a reasonable person, chances are that everyone else around him or her probably has the same idea. 

I interviewed with another firm (different city) and did not mention any of the above. I did emphasize that I enjoyed working with my colleagues, which was true, and that I just wanted a change; not hard to say when I was interviewing "up" at a more prestigious firm.

My advice would then be to just keep the reasons for you leaving general, not mention any personal conflicts, and just talk around those pretty obvious issues with general points about how you had a different work style because you are more collegial/team-orientated.

It really shouldn't take up much of the interview -- although, because you quit without a position lined up (I waited a couple of months and found a position first), you might have to be a little more forthright. Good luck. 

Edited by adVenture
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Thanks guys! During our phone interview, I said exactly what luckycharm suggested re: not seeing eye to eye. In person, we barely talked about the old workplace, except what I learned from there substantively regarding the law and procedures. I did emphasize that I gave adequate notice and left on good terms.

I really really hope this new situation works out, as I can't afford to make another jump. 

Edited by Throwaway999
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1 hour ago, Throwaway999 said:

Thanks guys! During our phone interview, I said exactly what luckycharm suggested re: not seeing eye to eye. In person, we barely talked about the old workplace, except what I learned from there substantively regarding the law and procedures. I did emphasize that I gave adequate notice and left on good terms.

I really really hope this new situation works out, as I can't afford to make another jump. 

You will probably become one of the best mentor for students who article with you...

Good luck

The Sun Will Shine Tomorrow
Poetry and Music By Andrew Pell
A Spiritual And Inspirational Poem from All-Creatures.org

Whatever we do whether be good or bad.
The sun will still shine tomorrow.
We do things and see things that make us feel sad.
But there will always be a tomorrow.
Do not dwell on past mistakes.
Detach yourself from all negativity and feeling anxious.
For the first time in your life you will be fully awake.
The opportunities are limitless.
Remember the sun will shine tomorrow.
Allow yourself to shine as well.
Imagine a day without heartache or sorrow.
Every day you will have a great story to tell.

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