Jump to content
LuckyCommander

Honest Opinion of the Dual JD at Windsor

Recommended Posts

I'm not too sure if this post belongs in the Windsor forum but I thought it would be useful to reach a larger audience.

I have recently gained an interest in the Dual JD Program at Windsor but I have seen some very mixed opinions. When doing research on specific firms and LinkedIn, I see that their graduates are able to land the same positions as regular grads in Ontario. They have landed positions on both sides of the border and are able to leverage their admission to two bars. For those who have close connections in both countries, why isn't this program more desired? I see that Ottawa also has a dual JD option - which is not as publicized as the program at Windsor. I know this is an exhausted discussion but I think it's fair to return to it for more recent opinions and insights.

With that, other than the exorbitant price tag and low admissions standards, why does the program receive so much criticism on this forum? I would like to see a constructive discussion on the merits and inferiorities of the program. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seems like to me that for positions that require only a Canadian JD, you only put that on your resume.  For positions that require both you would put both down.

 

Remembering myself in highschool I thought I was better than other students applying because I got accepted to an "elite" school compare to many other students.  I think the mixed reviews we read here are the remnants of that attitude. 

 

If it matters to you I am also applying to the double degree, but I actually like Detroit as a city for some reason and besides costs, and extra workload I struggle to see how this will truly hurt me. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think people have repeatedly acknowledged that it’s not an inferior program. You’re going to receive a pretty standard education at any of the Canadian law schools. I think the snobbery is due to the lower admission requirements of the dual program. People like having something to look down on because it makes them feel better. 

The price is insane and I don’t think it offers an advantage over a regular JD program but it’s not objectively bad or inferior 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There IS no reason other than the exorbitant costs and the low admissions standards. Do you really need to look beyond those two factors for an explanation? Windsor grads do reasonably well in Canada because of the relative reputability of the Windsor program. The dual students are, to a degree, free-riding on the reputation of the stronger single program. The "extra" qualification that the dual program comes with is a drag more than a draw.

There's no mystery here. The quality of a program is largely dependent on the quality of the students it admits. Pretending otherwise is stupid. That's like imagining if only weak students somehow got admitted to U of T, they'd end up as strong graduates and applicants after attending the school. That isn't true either. And so based on lower admissions standards, everyone knows what the Windsor Dual is - it's basically the lowest tier of law school graduates in Canada who actually managed to get in somewhere in Canada. Which is still better than those who go overseas for lack of domestic options. But that's another story.

Take the program with the worst reputation - based on the objectively reasonable criterion that it admits the weakest students - make it cost more than every other program ... and you need some kind of special, hidden reason to explain why it's everyone's last choice?

Edited by Diplock
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Diplock said:

There IS no reason other than the exorbitant costs and the low admissions standards. Do you really need to look beyond those two factors for an explanation? Windsor grads do reasonably well in Canada because of the relative reputability of the Windsor program. The dual students are, to a degree, free-riding on the reputation of the stronger single program. The "extra" qualification that the dual program comes with is a drag more than a draw.

There's no mystery here. The quality of a program is largely dependent on the quality of the students it admits. Pretending otherwise is stupid. That's like imagining if only weak students somehow got admitted to U of T, they'd end up as strong graduates and applicants after attending the school. That isn't true either. And so based on lower admissions standards, everyone knows what the Windsor Dual is - it's basically the lowest tier of law school graduates in Canada who actually managed to get in somewhere in Canada. Which is still better than those who go overseas for lack of domestic options. But that's another story.

Take the program with the worst reputation - based on the objectively reasonable criterion that it admits the weakest students - make it cost more than every other program ... and you need some kind of special, hidden reason to explain why it's everyone's last choice?

The GOAT has spoken - I remember reading Diplock's posts when I was lurking this forum in my first year of undergrad.

I feel that the dual degree can be as good as you make it. Obviously, I don't have any personal experience with it, but I know people have landed similar jobs that students from other Canadian law schools have landed. Beyond the price tag and the said "reputation" that others may have about it, if you feel that you can leverage the degrees by networking and working hard, I think you could be in a good position to succeed as much as the next Canadian law student. 

Edited by onone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Diplock said:

There IS no reason other than the exorbitant costs and the low admissions standards. Do you really need to look beyond those two factors for an explanation? Windsor grads do reasonably well in Canada because of the relative reputability of the Windsor program. The dual students are, to a degree, free-riding on the reputation of the stronger single program. The "extra" qualification that the dual program comes with is a drag more than a draw.

There's no mystery here. The quality of a program is largely dependent on the quality of the students it admits. Pretending otherwise is stupid. That's like imagining if only weak students somehow got admitted to U of T, they'd end up as strong graduates and applicants after attending the school. That isn't true either. And so based on lower admissions standards, everyone knows what the Windsor Dual is - it's basically the lowest tier of law school graduates in Canada who actually managed to get in somewhere in Canada. Which is still better than those who go overseas for lack of domestic options. But that's another story.

Take the program with the worst reputation - based on the objectively reasonable criterion that it admits the weakest students - make it cost more than every other program ... and you need some kind of special, hidden reason to explain why it's everyone's last choice?

Thank you for your honesty. After searching the forum, I noticed that those were the biggest concerns and was just curious to find out if there are any other glaring inferiorities. In the event that I am not accepted to any regular Canadian JD programs, would I be better off completing a masters or working before reapplying?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, LuckyCommander said:

Thank you for your honesty. After searching the forum, I noticed that those were the biggest concerns and was just curious to find out if there are any other glaring inferiorities. In the event that I am not accepted to any regular Canadian JD programs, would I be better off completing a masters or working before reapplying?

 

Masters degrees rarely seem helpful for admissions, and working would only be helpful if you were applying to a school that took that into account, and you did so for some time in some way that made you a better candidate.

 

How to improve an application after rejections always depends on why you were refused. For most people, the single easiest component to improve on would be the LSAT (which may also be why many Canadian schools weight it relatively lightly, and none use it as the primary entrance criteria, unlike many US schools).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, onone said:

The GOAT has spoken - I remember reading Diplock's posts when I was lurking this forum in my first year of undergrad.

I have to admit. I have no idea if I'm being complimented or dismissed, here.

Although, to be clear, I also agree with the remainder of your reply. That is, for those who can afford it (or are willing to assume the debt) the dual program gets you a Canadian law degree and puts you in a position to establish a career on near-equal footing with everyone else. I usually add a caution that recruiters appreciate the difference in strength from one law school to the next, which is why low-average students at U of T are unquestionably in a better position than low-average students at Windsor. But that's not to say a Windsor grad (or even dual) can't end up almost anywhere. It just means you shouldn't be complacent in terms of your need to compete. Get strong grades, put together a competitive CV. But if you do that, you'll be in good shape.

This is exactly why Windsor has such a great scam going here. They overcharge like hell for an additional qualification that most of the people attending the program don't even want. I don't know if it was designed that way, but that's what they've ended up with. That said, it's still a far better option for any domestic student than going foreign, which is why they stay full and manage to attract a pool of applicants that's not much weaker than any other program / law school.

Edited by Diplock
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Diplock said:

I have to admit. I have no idea if I'm being complimented or dismissed, here.

Although, to be clear, I also agree with the remainder of your reply. That is, for those who can afford it (or are willing to assume the debt) the dual program gets you a Canadian law degree and puts you in a position to establish a career on near-equal footing with everyone else. I usually add a caution that recruiters appreciate the difference in strength from one law school to the next, which is why low-average students at U of T are unquestionably in a better position than low-average students at Windsor. But that's not to say a Windsor grad (or even dual) can't end up almost anywhere. It just means you shouldn't be complacent in terms of your need to compete. Get strong grades, put together a competitive CV. But if you do that, you'll be in good shape.

This is exactly why Windsor has such a great scam going here. They overcharge like hell for an additional qualification that most of the people attending the program don't even want. I don't know if it was designed that way, but that's what they've ended up with. That said, it's still a far better option for any domestic student than going foreign, which is why they stay full and manage to attract a pool of applicants that's not much weaker than any other program / law school.

99% certain that was a compliment

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×