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easttowest

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  1. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    And I agree with you.
  2. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    No, I don't agree with that. I think there is probably a better system (...and I very well could be wrong. I often am!) than one where on the one hand we train an increasing number of people to become lawyers, and then on the other require them to obtain articles through unrelated institutions, who don't necessarily need more lawyers. So I'm suggesting that we either make it harder to become a law student in the first place, or coherently connect the education of law with the licensing of law. The "race to the bottom" has happened; students are already working for free.
  3. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    I don't agree with how you've sensationalized my first point, and I did not actually say the second thing. Regarding point two, as I said above ("account[ing] for protectionism") perhaps everyone must complete the LLP upon passing the bar. That way, everyone who passes the bar can become licensed to practice law in Ontario. There are obvious problems with that plan - more debt for all law students immediately comes to mind, and no articling students for firms who actually need them. However, at least in this basic plan, people who graduate law school and pass the bar can charge money for the services they went to school for, and potentially earn enough money to make a living. Additionally, there would likely be another race to the bottom, this time among recent calls. And, I admit that this would inevitably lead to poor client service. This version of that idea, essentially drawn up on the back of a napkin, obvious needs work! I just think that we can come up with a system that allows graduates of Canadian law schools to practice law in Canada. The system is apparently working for you. It's also working for me. That doesn't mean that it's working.
  4. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    As a non-conventional law student, I do have to agree with this.
  5. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    To bring this discussion back towards the topic of the thread, I guess the question is, who would we prefer have race to the bottom: articling students or recent calls?
  6. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    You know what I mean. It's the second requirement that we're arguing about.
  7. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    They were allowed to write the bar, though.
  8. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    I was unclear. I should have said legal licensing in Canada. I understand and agree with your reasoning, I just think that it is not reflected in the marketplace. Maybe we should license everybody, provided that we account for protectionism, and then let the market decide who makes it, like they do in the States.
  9. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    I would agree with you if this was a complete representation of legal education in Canada in 2018. You and I both know that it is not.
  10. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    This is an extreme version of my position, and not anything that I suggested. Allowing law schools to charge, essentially, whatever the market will bear to however many students they can reasonably fit in the building for a law degree and then punting the licensing requirement to mostly private bodies who may not be hiring doesn't strike me as particularly well thought-out. Add to that the influx of foreign-trained graduates and you have our articling "crisis." If all of this strikes you as perfectly fine and normal and good, then we'll never agree.
  11. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    Not if you restrict the seats.
  12. easttowest

    Question for current law students: tattoos!

    As an anecdote, I was at a panel that included an associate at a mid-size boutique who had visible tattoos extending past his shirt sleeves. I imagine he was heavily tattooed elsewhere.
  13. easttowest

    Articling -sole practitioner - salary range

    I think it is entirely reasonable to recognize something dissonant in a system where the education of law is separated from the licensing and practice of law. That this system more or less worked for a very long time does not mean that it is the right one. To say that you have "no time" for this discussion strikes me as rather callous.
  14. easttowest

    Changes to Scotiabank's Offering

    I agree, but perhaps in the interest of rolling out new national contracts it was simpler to just define the date a year later than change "12" to "24" on every relevant document. I can't speak to their motivation, only that my rep told me 24 months, and I have a contract that works out to 24 months. Regarding April or June... just speak to your rep. Law school does end in April but the bank gave me June so I just went with it.
  15. easttowest

    Changes to Scotiabank's Offering

    Mine has the same language, and then defines the date. The date is 12 months after I would actually have completed articles. You should have a line saying something to the effect of "...your Program Study End Date (the date after which you have completed etc. etc.) is: 06/30/20XX." Then it should go on to state that repayment begins 12 months the Program Study End Date.
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