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FunnyLawName last won the day on October 3 2015

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  1. If you go to 'The Source' website and go through their 'P2P mentoring' you can search all the students who did SPI's. Just search by the Department of Justice.
  2. This was a good read. Thanks for sharing your experience.
  3. I haven't started yet - I'm still in my final year of law school. My intention with this thread was to figure out what it looks like to move from articling to being a lawyer in criminal law. I think this quoted response is actually the answer I was looking for. Looking at it, it seems obvious. However, for me that type of assertiveness for myself isn't something that comes naturally. And before I get the sideways-look and the "why go in to this field" questions, it's just a personal thing. I've had no problem advocating for client interests as a student. But obviously the transition that I'm looking ahead to requires some personal growth in terms of advocating self-interested positions - especially for afterwards in the business development side. I just didn't know how one should broach the subject of future employment because it's honestly something I've never had to do. And looking at other threads, albeit in a different practice area, it seems like there's a lot of taboos people have to navigate around. So I just wanted to make sure I didn't commit some massive criminal-law-faux-pas in the first couple weeks of articling. Part of this is also because I'm just starting exams and wanted to take my mind off the content and do some thinking about the future so I don't sewer myself right away.
  4. It's not off the table. I would have put it in the off-topic thread though.
  5. Fair enough. The question is premature. But I'm just trying to be proactive. For some reason I hadn't turned my mind to our earlier scenario where an articling student isn't necessarily hired back, but is provided space and support from the principal/firm. So there you go, success already.
  6. I guess it could lead to the self-fulfilling prophecy. I guess calling it an 'assumption' is wrong - I'm just planning for the scenario. I won't let it have a detrimental impact on my work.
  7. I definitely wasn't clear enough. I'm articling in a defence firm. It's all I'll be doing.
  8. Hi everyone, I'm just hoping to get some anecdotes with regard to experiences moving from an articling position to practicing in criminal law - more specifically, how the hell is it done? I've looked at all the other posts on here, but in my reading they're mostly about how to get a student job or articles in the field, and more descriptive experiences to help guide students in to, or away from, the field (I'm linking them below so people don't have to wade through old posts again). I'm lucky enough to have articles in the field in a large Canadian city (not Toronto), and I'm starting this summer. The most prudent approach right now is to assume that my firm won't be hiring me back so I'm starting this topic solely to hear about how people transitioned from articling to an actual practice - either as a sole or as part of a firm. My question really boils down to how to get a job in criminal law when I'm done articling and I'm not hired back at my firm. Are there more jobs out there for first-year associate positions than it seems by browsing job sites? It seems like in my city most people have been doing it for at least five years already. And where they haven't, they have an 'in' at their firm through an older family member. My apologies if this has been answered before. I couldn't find anything specific to this. As promised, and just to add at least some value to my post other than to myself, here are the main threads I read before posting my question. Hegdis' Omnibus Topic on the practice of Criminal Law The classic 'what is working in criminal law like; (featuring Hegdis' first post ever) Diplock's AMA on criminal defence
  9. I can't comment on whether you should or shouldn't take the test this year. I can say that I took the test 5 different times and ended up getting in to law school on my second attempt. My first go was in my final year of undergrad and a fair bit of studying (though, admittedly, it wasn't that well thought out). I ended up with a 152. That was when I had to wait again a couple years for a retake. During that time period I went to grad school and, obviously, got older and matured a bit. My second go at taking the LSAT was a major difference. Things just clicked easier. So I think something can be said for playing the long game on the LSAT and learning how to take the test. So my advice to you I guess would be don't feel like it's the end of the world. I think the LSAT is absolutely a learnable test.
  10. I have an anecdote, since you asked. It's by no means true for anyone outside of the particular situation. I worked with a lawyer who applied to Osgoode several years after graduating from his undergrad. In those years the school he graduated from had misplaced his transcripts, but still had proof of graduation. Osgoode admitted him based on the other aspects of his application. So maybe that will make you feel better. But there's no way to say how your situation will be treated.
  11. Ah shit. That sucks. I'm choosing to look at not getting a public sector articling position as a blessing then.
  12. In my interview with the Toronto Crown they told me they were going through with hiring for both positions. Nothing about ongoing positions after though (I didn't ask).
  13. Pretty sure calls are made at the end of the day. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, though.
  14. I have an MPA and I'm in my final year of law school. I have about three years combined policy work, and I'm looking to work as a criminal law attorney. I'm avoiding policy work specifically because of how separated it is from working with the general population. And because of how ludicrously boring it is (to me, at least). Re: income - I don't know why you (and others) don't think government policy analysts don't make respectable money. Senior analysts, which is a position one can move in to after a relatively short amount of time, make $75,000 - $80,000. This is a very respectable amount of money that a lot of the people in this country don't even come close to approaching in their own jobs. Here's the EC pay scale for the federal government. An MPA and some experience would make you competitive for policy positions in any government with lots of room for growth (though they are very competitive). I would say policy work (at least for the feds and Ontario government) is on par with what a lot of lawyers make. If you're in Ontario though.... not sure about any opportunities given the current state of the public service. Buck-a-beer though.... Re: improving people's lives - very noble and laudable. From my experience though, this is not a feeling one gets from policy work. I worked in a policy area that is right up your alley - policy development and analysis for Ontario Works, ODSP, housing and other poverty reduction stuff - for the Government of Ontario. My work no doubt helped to influence policy and programming for the people who used these services, but it was always put through like ten different channels. By the time any substantive changes or decisions occurred I had really forgotten about any input I may have had. I would say that's a universal characteristic of all government policy work. Inf act, this is why I left policy and I'm looking to work in criminal law. But don't let that dissuade you. I just wanted to work closer to the population. You might derive the same type of satisfaction as I do working directly with people through policy work.
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