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Showing content with the highest reputation on 03/25/19 in all areas

  1. 7 points
    Just wanted to update everyone. I got the offer and turned it down. I feel bad because I like the firm and its people a lot. But ultimately it's the right decision. I wanted to say thanks for all your input, it helped steer me in the right direction.
  2. 5 points
    Or, to add to that, that comment seems premised on the belief that one ought to find one's 'meaning' in one's vocation. I think this is an assumption that also too often goes unquestioned. The notion that a job itself must be 'fulfilling' in and of itself -- or, that it is an unqualified good thing if one's career is the source of meaning in one's life -- is often quite toxic, in my opinion. Happiness can spring anywhere. I don't doubt for a second that there are some people for whom there are some practices which grant this kind of big-picture fulfillment. In fact, I know the search for this fulfillment is why a lot of people go into law. But I don't think we need to second-guess anyone wanting to do corporate law, or law more generally, for instrumental reasons. It can allow you to (e.g.) take care of their loved-ones or invest (in the broad sense) in other valuable activities. It might even be (gasp) satisfying work, even if morally neutral. That said, I agree that these are the kinds of questions you should ask yourself when taking jobs. And I'm glad that Pzabby chose the right option for him.
  3. 5 points
    To me, the key part of this subject title is the anxiety over giving up something "for good." That's something you (and all law students) need to make peace with. When you are young and talented and privileged you go all your early life getting told you can do anything. You internalize that message. And to a degree there's truth to it. But the other side of that truth is that you won't do everything. You can't. Obviously. Don't try to keep all your options open. It's an idiotic and self-defeating way to live. Every choice you make, every path you commit to, implicitly rejects other choices and other paths. If you fear closing off options, you'll continually hedge against committing to the things you actually want. And that's no way to live.
  4. 4 points
    got the meet n greet email today and called in to confirm i've been accepted! cgpa: 3.27 L2: 3.37 LSAT: 163 slightly above avg ECs (i think?), very average LORs, and PS tailored to windsor pretty surprised given my gpa, but extremely excited
  5. 4 points
    Since the deadline to accept is April 1, I was wondering if more offers will come out before then this week. Especially for Osgoode and Ottawa.
  6. 3 points
    I'm glad pzabby made the right decision, for him. And just to riff off his reasoning, for a moment, I'm sure he does not believe and I do not believe that the practice of corporate law is inherently unethical. But there's also very little that's potentially ethical about it, either. That is to say, if my practice basically consisted of helping corporations to make more money, and to keep the money they already have, I would have a hard time ever feeling like I'd done good with my job. And to me (now I'm diverging from pzabby) the difference largely comes down to serving individual people vs large corporate entities. Even a personal injury lawyer has good days. Maybe they spend a lot of time trying to argue up the damages in slip and fall cases where the actual harm was minimal. But some days, I'm sure, they actually save someone's life. And that's got to feel good. I think students and would-be applicants don't confront this reality directly. But they should. I'm not saying there are "good" and "bad" areas of law. As a criminal defence lawyer, certainly there are many people who would say I'm the bad guy. But whatever you do, you need to feel it's meaningful, and not just the way to make the most money. Ethics may be relative. But whatever your ethics may be, your job should feel like it fits within them, at least some of the time. Without that, you'll burn out pretty quick.
  7. 3 points
    i got through, and as you all suggested i've been accepted!!
  8. 3 points
    Lol, it’s way harder to get an ONCA or SCC clerkship than an OCI job! I wouldn’t hang my hat on that either!
  9. 3 points
    Just to chime in on foreign law schools and jobs. For context my experience comes from being in the support team at a small-mid sized firm firm that does a lot of work in rural areas. This means the hiring pool isn't nearly as competitive as big law. With that said, I've seen two types of applicants come in. The first is someone who holds a foreign law degree because they lived in the country and wanted to be a lawyer in that country so they got a law degree in that country and practiced as a lawyer in that country. Now they have immigrated to Canada and still want to be a lawyer so they are taking steps for that. This person had a decent chance compared to the applicants that come from domestic law schools but the fact that their experience is in a foreign jurisdiction is definitely a factor in their job prospects. The second is a Canadian citizen who went somewhere else for their law degree and this raises all kinds of red flags to the partners doing the hiring. The general feeling of these applicants is that they couldn't cut it in Canadian law schools and went with an easier path instead of making themselves better applicants. These applicants generally have little chance if even getting an interview unless they have something truly outstanding on their resume. And I do mean truly outstanding not just interesting or unique. This was the situation in looking for lawyers in rural BC, Bay street is significantly more competitive. Do everything you can to get into a Canadian law school, or don't go to law school and consider different career options, there's a ton of other careers that are equal to or better than law
  10. 3 points
  11. 2 points
    Just wondering if anyone is attending the meet and greet this Wednesday? Looking forward to meeting everyone!!
  12. 2 points
    The fact that Canadian universities are allowed to promote garbage programs like this at the expense of unsuspecting high school students who believe that holding a law degree makes you a lawyer is just deplorable.
  13. 2 points
    @Uriel described the appeal of transactional/corporate work very coherently here, but he's so preternaturally persuasive that I'm pretty sure he could stocking shelves at Walmart sound meaningful (I have, in fact, received money to stock shelves at Walmart, although very briefly):
  14. 2 points
    I'm glad pzabby made the right decision, for him. And just to riff off his reasoning, for a moment, I'm sure he does not believe and I do not believe that the practice of criminal law is inherently unethical. But there's also very little that's potentially ethical about it, either. That is to say, if my practice basically consisted of helping rapists get away with rape, murderers get away with murders and robbers to keep the money they already stole, I would have a hard time ever feeling like I'd done good with my job. And to me (now I'm diverging from pzabby) the difference largely comes down to serving individual GCs vs remorseless criminals.
  15. 2 points
    Annnnnd I'm referred - admission committee now
  16. 2 points
    You should go to the UofT. Yes, Oxford is awesome. Yes, the town is charming. Yes, you will impress people for the rest of your life by saying you went to Oxford. But if you want to work in Toronto, you may as well just make connections with classmates who will also work in the city, get settled and established in Toronto, learn Canadian law, etc. As awesome as Oxford is, you also don't want to do NCA exams.
  17. 2 points
  18. 2 points
    I'll be attending too! On the RSVP website it says "Business Attire is suggested"
  19. 2 points
    I didn't run closely with Big Law circles in law school, but I can say I know of a decent handful of people I graduated with who lateraled from being an associate on Bay to NYC. I do not know if they were approached or got in through some other means. I believe they were all in Bay Street corporate practices.
  20. 2 points
    Laterals from Bay are probably the easiest way to get a job in New York or another jurisdiction if you didn't start in New York with an OCI gig.
  21. 2 points
    There are a lot of people who work really hard. Almost none can afford the country's most expensive real estate fresh out of school. Why not rent something near Vic Park Station like everyone else does when they start out? In fact, your salary likely means you can rent something at St. Clair and Bathurst, or Dundas West. Both are pretty nice areas. Toronto real estate prices (both buying and renting) are a big problem. But not for people who earn more than Toronto's median household income on their own. You have tons of options when you make a good salary.
  22. 2 points
    Good Luck everyone for tomorrow !
  23. 2 points
    Then I wouldn't take a corporate law articling position.
  24. 1 point
    I'm an employment lawyer at a big company. You could say that I oppress workers for a living. Or you can recognize that I can actually do more things to make the lives of our tens of thousands of employees more fair than virtually any union lawyer can do by litigating a case. Corporate lawyers who practice in an ethical manner are a powerful force in businesses that try to operate in an ethical manner.
  25. 1 point
    referred - admission committee this afternoon
  26. 1 point
    Thanks @jennibee for figuring this out!
  27. 1 point
    ^ Just to reference what I was referring to in my post before this.
  28. 1 point
    I am coming too. Is anybody bringing guests?
  29. 1 point
    I'm coming ! see you there.
  30. 1 point
    I will be! Any ideas on what the dress code is?
  31. 1 point
    You're minimizing people's accomplishments by suggesting they are a direct result of some sort of advantage and, thereby, any resulting achievements were because of "privilege" and are somehow unworthy or unearned. I feel fortunate for the opportunities I've been given but, they were not handed to me. The opportunities were not a result of some sort of an advantage. Many of them were due to taking risks, sheer luck and/or hard work. If the "privilege" you're referring to means leaving everything behind in a war-torn country and growing up on welfare (with donation bin meals) then yes, completing post-secondary education and subsequently landing a great job with a good salary makes me privileged. Correct me if I'm wrong, and maybe I am but, I'm sure that you, out of most people here, would not appreciate being presumptuously labeled as "privileged" by someone who doesn't know your history.
  32. 1 point
    There are more qualified applicants for desirable legal positions than there are desirable positions. You would be putting yourself at a pretty extreme disadvantage coming from a foreign university that nobody has heard of. This is particularly true with respect to Bay Street where every year there are hundreds of students across Canada from domestic schools who are unable to secure a position. With the exception of having connections which guarantee you a position upon your return to Canada it's almost never a good idea to go foreign for law school if you want to practice in Canada.
  33. 1 point
    Diplock is proudly of the Denny Crane /Alan Shore generation. As am I. We learned. And they will too.
  34. 1 point
  35. 1 point
    My number one writing tip is to edit out extraneous adjectives. For style influence, I can never get enough of Justice Watt. He draws me in every time with his staccato-like sentences, and ends up painting such a vivid picture in my mind. From R v Shafia:
  36. 1 point
    The 'standard' is Laskin/Stratas point-first writing, e.g. http://www.ontariocourts.ca/coa/en/ps/speeches/forget.htm Whether that is 'good writing' or not is a matter of personal taste I guess.
  37. 1 point
    I turned down biglaw jobs for the same reason - it would only have been for the money, which was definitely needed, but I had zero interest in the type of work or the work environment and I wanted to do work I loved and felt good about. You will be fine if you don’t do biglaw - I am fine and wouldn’t change a thing. Life is too short. Don’t do it for the wrong reasons.
  38. 1 point
    Government loans don't charge interests while you're in school whereas a line of credit does. Once you're out of law school though, the government will start charging you interest and the interest rate will likely be higher than the one on the line of credit. So the best way to finance your education for most people will be to take out gov student loans and use that source of money first before reaching into the PSLOC. If you think you'll need more than what the gov will loan you, take out a PSLOC. The bank will only charge you interests on what you use so there's little harm in applying for one. (By 'charging interest' I mean that interests will accrue but you won't NEED to pay anything while you're in school). Once you're done with school, you can pay back all of your gov loans using your PSLOC if you still have space on it. By doing that, you'll be paying the bank's rate of interest as opposed to the gov's (which is higher).
  39. 1 point
    Not mind-boggling at all. Salaries aren’t determined based on relative levels of knowledge. They’re based on a variety of market forces so you can’t just ignore the cost of living. Biglaw associates start at $240k CAD in New York, which I also don’t find mind-boggling when you compare that legal market to any Canadian one.
  40. 1 point
    They've likely looked at you already if you applied in the general category. But there's no decision yet/the process isn't over for your file. For reference my file went from ready to review to accepted without any intermediate step (I didn't check all the time but every few days). Professors are busy. It takes time.
  41. 1 point
    I'm from Surrey, went to UBC Vancouver for my undergrad. Kamloops is small both in population and geography - especially compared to Greater Vancouver. But there's a lot to do and lots of great cafes, bars, and restaurants. Law school keeps you so busy that you probably won't have time to see all that Kamloops has to offer before you graduate. The only thing I think Kamloops is lacking is clothing stores - the mall isn't great and downtown only has one or two viable options (at least for men's clothes). The school is pretty diverse. In the law school alone we have the Indigenous Law Students Association, the South Asian Law Students Association, the Black Law Students Association, and others. Every school has good and bad professors, I've had a primarily positive experience with the professors here at TRU. "Bad" professors in this context means profs that aren't necessarily the best teachers, I've never heard of a professor being malicious, and the administration does everything it can to correct grades where it's found that a student was treated unfairly. The profs here have written textbooks, legislation, law journals, etc. They're all really invested in the success of the students. One thing that stands out about TRU Law is that we have a number of sessional professors who are practicing lawyers that the school flies into Kamloops on a weekly basis to teach courses (fly in Thursday morning, teach two classes, fly out Thursday night). These sessional profs are generally leading experts in their respective areas of law in downtown Vancouver - they teach based on their extensive experience and can be EXCELLENT references for you if you do well in their courses. In first year you don't get to choose your courses. Everyone takes Contracts, Constitutional, Property, Torts, Criminal from September to April. From September to December you also take "Legislation, Administration, and Policy," and from January to April you take Legal Perspectives. On top of all of that, you take a pass/fail course from September to March called Fundamental Legal Skills. You get to choose your courses for 2nd and 3rd year. Certain courses are offered consistently (ie, family law, trusts, wills and estates, tax law, etc.). Other specialty courses are offered on a rotating basis (one year on, one year off - ie, Video Game Law, Digital Media Law, Sports Law, etc.). 3 credit courses are 3 hours per week - either as a single 3 hour block or as two 1.5 hour classes. Administration tries its best to balance the available courses in each semester so that each semester has a fair number of "black letter" courses and "fun" courses like Video Game Law. But in the end it's subject to the availability of sessional professors and other factors.
  42. 1 point
    This is a very good post. And, as indicated by profreader's capitalization, point 4 is particularly important to academic success in law school. Your lectures and readings give you some tools to do well on the exam. But just reading and going to class won't necessarily teach you how to write the thing. Putting together the information into a good exam is a very specific skill, and not everyone (myself especially) knows what to do with the tools they've been acquiring all semester, until they've tried them out. Practice as much as you possibly can. Point 2 is essential for your mental health. Here is another post that I thought was so good, that I dug around to re-post it here:
  43. 1 point
    no /s sir. Shoot your shot.
  44. 1 point
    Dal 100% does for students in Atlantic Canada.
  45. 1 point
    I turned down this offer earlier today. Thank you all for your input.
  46. 1 point
    Holy shit that's amazing Ryn! Im just blown away by the fact that you thought to yourself 'hmm I'm only articling... Lemme just see if I can code a website and moderate another one in my free time'
  47. 1 point
    I understand this perspective, but if you have the kind of practise where your clients are addicted or mentally ill or unreasonably angry at / suspicious of The System for myriad reasons, you have to remain very much in the driver's seat. That can mean fighting with clients who are about to make a bad decision. Ultimately, if you are instructed to do a plea (and you can ethically plead them out) you do a plea. You also bring up how many triable issues there were that your client voluntarily gave up to accept responsibility - a mitigating factor. And ultimately, if you are instructed to go to trial and there's no defence available and the factors that will come out at trial are aggravating factors that make your client's situation worse, you get that all in down writing and signed well ahead of time, and you go to trial, because that is their right. But I think it's shoddy defence work to let your client make these calls without using everything you have at your professional disposal to convince them to make a decision in their own best interests. Legally speaking, that means avoiding a criminal record or minimizing the damage of exposure to bad facts. Your client's moral stance, guilty conscience, or refusal to acknowledge the harsh reality of their own guilt are not legal considerations. These things fall under client management. Your clients get the final word but you still owe them your professional best - and that can mean fighting them every step of the way.
  48. 1 point
    I confess to only skimming this thread but for the sake of honesty/good advice I feel someone needs to point out that the real reason most transactional lawyers are "interested" in transactional law is that, as a general matter, there are more varied and higher paying exit options for transactional lawyers than there are for litigators. Very few people are "interested" in corporate law any more than they're "interested" in investment banking -- it's a way to make money, and it offers some decent exit options if you're able to keep it up for a few years. Obviously some litigators manage to go in-house but the ratio of corporate to litigation opportunities has to be something like 6:1 for corporate and, further, many corporate lawyers are hoping eventually to transition to a business role. Before everyone clamors to point out that x, y and z in-house person who posts here and the current CEO of ABC Corp is a former litigator, I know about these people, I'm just giving you general facts. Most litigators end up less paid than most corporate lawyers, both in firms and outside of firms. This is the beginning and the end of most people's "interest" in transactional law.
  49. 1 point
    It is rare that a litigation lawyer is a rainmaker, but it does happen: particularly where the relationships she fosters are with repeat litigants like insurers or manufacturers. It also bears noting that no one knows who a "good" lawyer is, except by reputation. Where solicitors are out shaking hands at cocktail parties and being a fun, competent person, lawyers are out giving lectures at CLE events and being a fun, competent person. Corporate solicitors can easily target industry groups and clients directly. Litigators tend to have to target other lawyers to ensure the bolstering of their general reputation. I'm sure the best lawyer in Toronto is someone you've never heard of. But in many cases, the very famous people you have heard of are quite talented. In some cases, not. I recently had a chance to review the work of a legendary Toronto barrister working as an arbitrator, and it was frankly god-awful. "Good lawyer" is as much marketing as "good guy" is.
  50. 1 point
    Ugh, I was criticizing your need to label. Also your need to differentiate yourself from those that you are so quick to "other". You're the "acceptable" immigrant while those "fobs" are sticking to cultural ties and identity, elevating your status over theirs. Just because you've emigrated doesn't mean you aren't showing any forms of hostility towards immigrants, especially those that cling to their own culture. You make special consideration to call them out as an obvious flaw in the school. Now you speak of multiculturalism being a good thing. Homogenized multiculturalism? In any case, I was calling you out on hating groups of people and using an unacceptable term.
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