pattie12

Articling Rates

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Hello,

does anyone know the articling rates of UNB grads? How hard is it to find a job upon graduation?

thnx 

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Hello,

does anyone know the articling rates of UNB grads? How hard is it to find a job upon graduation?

thnx 

 

You may want to contact the Career Services Office at Ludlow Hall, they keep tabs on students who graduate (or try to keep tabs anyway) to make sure everyone who wanted articles finds them. 

 

Generally speaking, everyone who wants articles gets them, it just depends on how much you're willing to compromise. There are only 3 big regional firms, they hire 1-2 students per office and most of them come from either UNB or Dal. Outside of that, smaller but still mid-size firms from Atlantic cities do OCIs and may hire someone. A lot of the onus is on you as the student and article seeker to find articles though, so how hard it is would probably depend on how much work you put into knocking on doors. The aforementioned CSO and Martha (she's great by the way) down in that office, is always able to help you one way or another.

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I don't know how much all the articling students are getting paid, but one friend just got articles at $30,000/year (no benefits, no overtime, no holiday pay). I'm friends with a few other people who article for one of the bigger firms that make $36,000 and get a signing bonus. That's all the info I have. As for the finding articles if you want them, it is a very difficult time right now. A lot of people just are not hiring. People with amazing resumes don't have anything.

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I don't know how much all the articling students are getting paid, but one friend just got articles at $30,000/year (no benefits, no overtime, no holiday pay). I'm friends with a few other people who article for one of the bigger firms that make $36,000 and get a signing bonus. That's all the info I have. As for the finding articles if you want them, it is a very difficult time right now. A lot of people just are not hiring. People with amazing resumes don't have anything.

 

You may want to contact the Career Services Office at Ludlow Hall, they keep tabs on students who graduate (or try to keep tabs anyway) to make sure everyone who wanted articles finds them. 

 

Generally speaking, everyone who wants articles gets them, it just depends on how much you're willing to compromise. There are only 3 big regional firms, they hire 1-2 students per office and most of them come from either UNB or Dal. Outside of that, smaller but still mid-size firms from Atlantic cities do OCIs and may hire someone. A lot of the onus is on you as the student and article seeker to find articles though, so how hard it is would probably depend on how much work you put into knocking on doors. The aforementioned CSO and Martha (she's great by the way) down in that office, is always able to help you one way or another.

 

How sure are you guys of that info re. bigger firms?

 

The reason I ask is because I articled in 2012/2013, and there was no signing bonus, but the salary was higher than $36k (not including benefits, Xmas bonus, etc.) There were also 7 articling students at the Halifax office my firm, and about the same at the Halifax offices of the other two "big law" firms (almost all from UNB and Dal). I'd be surprised if salaries dropped, and I know the number of articling students hired hasn't dropped (in fact there are more this year than in 2012/2013.)

Edited by conge

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How sure are you guys of that info re. bigger firms?

 

The reason I ask is because I articled in 2012/2013, and there was no signing bonus, but the salary was higher than $36k (not including benefits, Xmas bonus, etc.) There were also 7 articling students at the Halifax office my firm, and about the same at the Halifax offices of the other two "big law" firms (almost all from UNB and Dal). I'd be surprised if salaries dropped, and I know the number of articling students hired hasn't dropped (in fact there are more this year than in 2012/2013.)

 

I'm only speaking from what I see/hear. In 2014, 2015 and 2016 hiring cycles there were no more than 2 UNB students in each year hired at any one office of the large firms, the most I had heard of total for articling positons at one office was 4, and that was a post-merger type of deal. I don't know much about Halifax but I do know that some other branches of the large firms chose not to hire anyone this year at all.

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I'm only speaking from what I see/hear. In 2014, 2015 and 2016 hiring cycles there were no more than 2 UNB students in each year hired at any one office of the large firms, the most I had heard of total for articling positons at one office was 4, and that was a post-merger type of deal. I don't know much about Halifax but I do know that some other branches of the large firms chose not to hire anyone this year at all.

 

Yeah, there are likely big differences between the Halifax offices of the big firms and the NB/PE/NL offices in terms of hiring.

 

UNB students seem to do decently well in Halifax. It's true the majority of Halifax hires are from Dal (I'm a Dal grad), but that could be due to self selection by UNB students to look elsewhere as anything else.

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How sure are you guys of that info re. bigger firms?

 

The reason I ask is because I articled in 2012/2013, and there was no signing bonus, but the salary was higher than $36k (not including benefits, Xmas bonus, etc.) There were also 7 articling students at the Halifax office my firm, and about the same at the Halifax offices of the other two "big law" firms (almost all from UNB and Dal). I'd be surprised if salaries dropped, and I know the number of articling students hired hasn't dropped (in fact there are more this year than in 2012/2013.)

 

I only know what my friends who work at those firms have told me. Whether it's the truth or not, I can't speak for that. But none of them work in Halifax; all NB. 

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I don't know how much all the articling students are getting paid, but one friend just got articles at $30,000/year (no benefits, no overtime, no holiday pay). I'm friends with a few other people who article for one of the bigger firms that make $36,000 and get a signing bonus. That's all the info I have. As for the finding articles if you want them, it is a very difficult time right now. A lot of people just are not hiring. People with amazing resumes don't have anything.

 

$36,000 is not accurate for big regional firms in NB. The salary at one of the three is $46,000 + benefits (health, dental, life and disability insurance, parking, bar admission course + fees). I'm not sure of the exact figure for the others but I imagine Stewart McKelvey, McInnes Cooper and Cox and Palmer all offer similar compensation to articling students. I haven't heard of anyone receiving a "signing bonus", but at least one of the three offers a forgivable loan for 3L. 

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I've heard 30% cant find articles. That seems high to me. I'd guess, within 6 months of graduating only about 10% of those that want articles cant get them. I'm just guessing though. 

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Unsure where these figures are coming from - 30%? I graduated a few years ago and in my year 90% of us had articles lined up before we graduated. A few who where looking did not, but there were also a few who simply were not looking. From my year a good percentage of people articled in Ontario (15%?). In terms of UNB v Dal at the big three in Halifax - you only need to look at the bios of the junior lawyers to see that there seems to be a pretty even distribution. It may not be equal every year, but going through the process myself I did not notice any preference for Dal students per se, if two students are equally competitive then it seems that the Atlantic Canada firms are then trying to ensure that they hire people who actually want to work in Halifax/ Fredericton/ St John  etc ... (i.e. it matters why you applied in that city) rather than strictly comparing Dal to UNB as schools. UNB may not have a big national reputation, but I never had the sense in Atlantic Canada that UNB was seen as a worse degree than Dal. 

Regarding OP's question of "how hard is it to find a job" - the question is simply too general. What province are you coming from? Where will you be looking for articles? Which area of law do you think you would like to look in? And once you actually are in law school - what are your grades, softs, are you a good interviewee, etc - all of that impacts your chances of employment ... not surprisingly. 

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It is more challenging to find articles now than it has been in the past. The OCI process will not result in a position for everyone so your best bet is to start thinking about summering and articling positions early in your law school career. There is nothing wrong with reaching out to lawyers or articling students at firms you are interested in for coffee or lunch long before the job hunt begins, in fact it might be less awkward that way. Just be aware that there is a lot of competition and plan accordingly. 

The below email was sent to the membership of the Law Society of New Brunswick on May 17, 2017:

This year, many graduates with Common Law degrees are having difficulty finding an articling position, which is unusual.

 The Law Society of New Brunswick is strongly encouraging law firms to hire articling students so that they can complete their professional legal education and then apply for admission to the Law Society of New Brunswick as barristers and solicitors.

 The ultimate objective of the admission program is to ensure that future lawyers are competent and to uphold the values of the profession, including ethics and the protection of the public. Articles are an important part of the admission program, and one of the distinguishing features of the legal profession in New Brunswick is the willingness of members of the Law Society and the judiciary to join forces and help new members and participants to meet this objective.

 Please note that the New Brunswick government offers financial assistance programs that can help defray the cost of hiring an articling student. You will find a link to the program below:

 https://www.nbjobs.ca/employers

 http://www2.gnb.ca/content/gnb/en/services/services_renderer.201375.Youth_Employment_Fund.html

 Also, an articling student can request a transfer of articles, which means that you can provide a position for less than a year, and then the articling student can request a transfer of articles and complete his or her education at another firm.

 If you are able to hire a student for an articling position, please contact Ms. Lise Briard ([email protected]), Administrative Assistant for the Faculty of Law at l'Université de Moncton, Ms. Martha McClellan ([email protected]), Senior Administrative Officer at the Faculty of Law, University of New Brunswick, or Ms. Guylaine Godin ([email protected]), Director of Admissions, Law Society of New Brunswick.

 

 

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That email is a little disheartening. I didn't realize the articling situation in the Maritimes was at that point. 

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