75 replies to this topic

[UselessJD]

Mal, on 24 December 2011 - 06:28 PM, said:

Actually, I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about. From my understanding Georgetown is lucky to place 1/3 of its class in the "biglaw" employment, and really lucky if 70% get legal jobs at all.

Toronto still places 95% of their grads in legal jobs.

Do you have any clue what you're talking about? I know things are rough in the US, but I've seen no indication they're so bad that T14s are struggling to place 70% of their students in legal jobs. And the figure you're citing for U of T is articling placement, which is just a 10-month term after which a lot of people get laid off.

[erinl2]

UselessJD, is it really necessary to resurrect your complaints yet again, and on Christmas Eve no less? If there's anyone here who needs to enjoy the weekend with friends and family, good food and drink, and forget about law school, it's you. Please, for the sake of all that's holy or otherwise, give it a rest.

[whereverjustice]

Mal, on 24 December 2011 - 06:28 PM, said:

From my understanding Georgetown is lucky to place 1/3 of its class in the "biglaw" employment, and really lucky if 70% get legal jobs at all.

It's that bad even for a T14 now? Egad. I had no idea.

[BrianGriffintheDog]

This is why I love LSAT-loving law schools in the States. It gives people a second chance to actually succeed in life.

[QuincyWagstaff]

BrianGriffintheDog, on 04 January 2012 - 08:46 PM, said:

This is why I love LSAT-loving law schools in the States. It gives people a second chance to actually succeed in life.

This is true, but you have to do significantly better with that GPA. A two second search on LSN revealed that the OP never got into GULC, got shutout of GW in fact, but did get UofM. Not that I really give a shit, but just sayin'

[UNBer06]

I signed up for an account just so I could say that if you really think you will end up working in Canada, going to law school outside Canada is a BAD idea. You may even have to go back to law school. There were 2 people in my school who were both actually admitted to the bar elsewhere, one in the US and one in England. They had to take a year or a year and a half of classes to qualify in Canada. I know someone else who went to school in England and now they have to write a series of equivalency exams before they can article. It will set you back at least a year or two if you go to a foreign school. On the other hand, if you go to a Canadian school, you can write the bar exam in most US states. You decide which is better.

[tng11]

QuincyWagstaff, on 04 January 2012 - 09:11 PM, said:

This is true, but you have to do significantly better with that GPA. A two second search on LSN revealed that the OP never got into GULC, got shutout of GW in fact, but did get UofM. Not that I really give a shit, but just sayin'

I just hopped over to LSN to take a look. OP has zero chance at GULC IMO.

US schools love the LSAT, but they all have GPA floors that are pretty evident looking at LSN graphs (i.e. you aren't getting in with a GPA below the floor even with a 180 LSAT). People with anything below 3.3 are pretty much restricted to Northwestern, other T14s don't like anything below 3.5, and HYS+Berkeley have a strong disdain for anything below 3.8.

Despite the fact that LSAT takers in the US have declined, and thus there are less high scores to fill the lofty LSAT medians at the top schools, HLS is seemingly more concerned with maintaining its insanely high GPA quartiles, opting to take people with 171-174 LSATs and 3.9+ GPAs. A number of 175+ LSATs were dinged today, including me. So the LSAT is not a saviour at least for those schools.

[mcakes]

tng11, on 06 January 2012 - 09:27 PM, said:

I just hopped over to LSN to take a look. OP has zero chance at GULC IMO.

US schools love the LSAT, but they all have GPA floors that are pretty evident looking at LSN graphs (i.e. you aren't getting in with a GPA below the floor even with a 180 LSAT). People with anything below 3.3 are pretty much restricted to Northwestern, other T14s don't like anything below 3.5, and HYS+Berkeley have a strong disdain for anything below 3.8.

Despite the fact that LSAT takers in the US have declined, and thus there are less high scores to fill the lofty LSAT medians at the top schools, HLS is seemingly more concerned with maintaining its insanely high GPA quartiles, opting to take people with 171-174 LSATs and 3.9+ GPAs. A number of 175+ LSATs were dinged today, including me. So the LSAT is not a saviour at least for those schools.

I thought the OP was already in at GULC. Why would somebody lie about that?

Edit: See post #25, page 1 of the thread

Edited by mcakes, 06 January 2012 - 09:53 PM.

[pk_00]

UNBer06, on 06 January 2012 - 09:17 PM, said:

I signed up for an account just so I could say that if you really think you will end up working in Canada, going to law school outside Canada is a BAD idea. You may even have to go back to law school. There were 2 people in my school who were both actually admitted to the bar elsewhere, one in the US and one in England. They had to take a year or a year and a half of classes to qualify in Canada. I know someone else who went to school in England and now they have to write a series of equivalency exams before they can article. It will set you back at least a year or two if you go to a foreign school. On the other hand, if you go to a Canadian school, you can write the bar exam in most US states. You decide which is better.

Well, 3 states -- but who's counting?

[tng11]

mcakes, on 06 January 2012 - 09:52 PM, said:

I thought the OP was already in at GULC. Why would somebody lie about that?

Edit: See post #25, page 1 of the thread

The OP posted that he was admitted back on December 11th, but the last update to his LSN profile was seemingly December 16th, but shows no sign of a GT acceptance. I think OP is trying to inflate his scenario, it's more likely AU/GWU (since they're D.C. schools) vs. Manitoba. Big difference there even though they're T1 schools, as the dropoff in quality from T14 downwards is pretty significant.

He did mention getting a GT interview request- and maybe he's presuming that to be a good chance for admission?

Edited by tng11, 07 January 2012 - 06:17 AM.

[mcakes]

tng11, on 07 January 2012 - 06:15 AM, said:

The OP posted that he was admitted back on December 11th, but the last update to his LSN profile was seemingly December 16th, but shows no sign of a GT acceptance. I think OP is trying to inflate his scenario, it's more likely AU/GWU (since they're D.C. schools) vs. Manitoba. Big difference there even though they're T1 schools, as the dropoff in quality from T14 downwards is pretty significant.

He did mention getting a GT interview request- and maybe he's presuming that to be a good chance for admission?

Hm. I saw that too. Just seems like there would be no reason to lie on an anonymous internet forum if you are asking for advice. Not that I care obviously, I just find it a bit odd. As you point out, there is a big difference between GULC vs. Manitoba and AU/GWU vs. Manitoba, and I'm sure that the advice/opinions offered would have reflected that difference.

[conge]

mcakes, on 07 January 2012 - 07:01 AM, said:

Hm. I saw that too. Just seems like there would be no reason to lie on an anonymous internet forum if you are asking for advice. Not that I care obviously, I just find it a bit odd. As you point out, there is a big difference between GULC vs. Manitoba and AU/GWU vs. Manitoba, and I'm sure that the advice/opinions offered would have reflected that difference.

The advice/opinions offered would have most certainly reflected that difference - why the would OP lie?

[tng11]

conge, on 07 January 2012 - 07:15 AM, said:

The advice/opinions offered would have most certainly reflected that difference - why the would OP lie?

I'd still like to give the OP the benefit of the doubt and say he didn't intend to lie. He's probably preparing for the possibility he gets into GULC given that he got the interview invite, and at the same time we've answered that anything below T14 probably isn't worth it. Gets two birds with one stone.

[Stupor]

An admission at Georgetown isn't impossible for the OP. If his LSAT can help Georgetown prop up its 25/75 LSATs (super important for ranking), then his GPA might well be overlooked, since Georgetown can afford to admit up to 25% of its class with arbitrarily low GPAs and still maintain a good 25th percentile GPA (which is all that matters for ranking purposes).

[tng11]

Stupor, on 07 January 2012 - 02:17 PM, said:

An admission at Georgetown isn't impossible for the OP. If his LSAT can help Georgetown prop up its 25/75 LSATs (super important for ranking), then his GPA might well be overlooked, since Georgetown can afford to admit up to 25% of its class with arbitrarily low GPAs and still maintain a good 25th percentile GPA (which is all that matters for ranking purposes).

To be accurate, I believe the USNWR rankings are based off medians:

http://www.usnews.co...ethodology-2012

Maybe saying the OP has a zero chance at GULC is a bit harsh. In the last few cycles on LSN GULC has only dipped below the 3.0 floor despite 170+ LSATs a handful of times for non-URMs, and these applicants were extremely close (think 2.98 or 2.99).

US schools are behaving differently this cycle because of the fewer test takers, and accordingly, fewer 170+ LSATs, so schools may be sacrificing GPA for LSATs. (e.g. NYU is accepting 3.3 GPAs early this year) Not much is going to change at HYS though, their GPA quartiles have seen a major uptick in the last few years, they've always rejected applicants with solid numbers and probably can afford to continue doing so as their rankings aren't close to being threatened.

[Stupor]

tng11, on 07 January 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

To be accurate, I believe the USNWR rankings are based off medians:

http://www.usnews.co...ethodology-2012

"The combined median scores" are used. I'm pretty sure that means the average of 25/75 LSATs (and GPAs), and that the USN uses this instead of the actual median because the former is also reported to the ABA, which has the power to punish liars (e.g. Villanova).

Of course, the USN's de facto leverage over law schools is arguably greater than the enumerated powers of the ABA, but given law schools' resentment of this fact, they would probably feel less compelled to provide accurate information to the USN than to the ABA, and potential whistleblowers less compelled to speak up (Villanova: well, we told the ABA our 25/75 LSATs were 161/166; let's just tell the USN our median was 165 - who's going to know?)

Edited by Stupor, 07 January 2012 - 02:49 PM.