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Demander

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  1. Really need advice for law school and life

    Hey! It looks like there's lots of good advice from the other posts here already, but I wanted to add/ reiterate two things: 1. I would recommend thinking about how you would answer these before deciding if law school makes sense for you: What draws you towards wanting to be a Crown prosecutor, judge, or law professor? Or any other law job? What kinds of tasks do people in these jobs do on a day-to-day basis? What kinds of tasks do you enjoy doing? If you didn't go to law school, what would you be doing? The answers to those questions would probably also help you when figuring out what to write for your personal statement, if you choose to apply. 2. About #6. You can find lots of information on this site that can point you in the right direction, but you should also try to find some people around you who are either law students or lawyers or people who have applied to law school, who would be willing to tell you more about what the process was like for them. They would probably also tell you more about all the law schools they applied to, and that could help you pick a school that best suits you. I would very very very strongly recommend doing a lot of research about what kinds of jobs you would want to do in general, including but not limited to law jobs. You could start with your school's career office, or go online, or talk to people you know in careers you think you might find interesting. Think about what you enjoy doing, and what you would actually want to do as a job. Then go find jobs that meet your criteria. Then start looking at any additional education or whatever you would need for those jobs. I'm not trying to warn you away from law - hope this doesn't come off that way! It just seemed from your post that you weren't too sure about whether you wanted to do a law job/ what law school required. A lot of people in my undergrad seemed to feel like once they'd started considering the law, they were locked in to that aspiration forever. Later, they would realize that they actually wanted to do a history masters or work for an NGO or become a filmmaker or whatever. So they ended up wasting a lot of time and money because they sort of felt that if they could make themselves into a lawyer, then that's what they "should" be doing. Some of this came from family pressures and some of it from misconceptions about what lawyers are/do. You're still in undergrad and have lots of time to research/ think about this - so don't get locked in as you search for your ideal career path.
  2. But to avoid diverting too much from OP's question - what do people do during class to get the most out of it? I know some people type out everything the prof says like a court stenographer, while others just sit back and listen, etc.
  3. I agree with you @Queensberry - I think I did get those things from speaking to profs, but it might be that I came into law school with lofty expectations of having the material really spoon-fed to me. As I mentioned before, I generally found lectures extremely unhelpful - maybe I just got unlucky with profs, but in general they seemed to just re-hash whatever I read from the case (and textbook/secondary sources) already without really adding much else. The only time I really got something more was when I spoke to them after class or in office hours - and for that, I had to come in with specific questions that demanded a simple answer. Profs are certainly helpful to learn from for the reasons you explained. I guess I'm just not a lecture person and find that I get the answers I need by either speaking to the profs directly or by consulting other sources or by working it out on my own/with classmates.
  4. Yeah the idea of "wasting' my tuition money by skipping lectures always kept me coming back to the classroom... I didn't mean to sound whiny - just felt a bit frustrating with how little I felt I was benefiting from this teaching I am paying so much for. I definitely don't understand everything 100% with no uncertainties before class, but I often find that the profs I've had, with one exception, are pretty vague and evasive about answering questions during class. I also find that I just learn better from talking things over with classmates or learning things from the textbooks or other books outside the classroom. The only times I've really found profs useful are when I have highly specific yes or no questions about whether I have understood a point of law correctly. Maybe this is just a learning style thing. The one prof I found I gained the most from did very little lecturing - most of the class was spent with the students answering the prof's questions and sort of reasoning as a group towards an understanding of the law. I find I learned more from that kind of two-way exchange than from listening to a lecture.
  5. Hey I attended all my classes and did the readings - I was just asking how best to use the time while I'm there. Since I didn't feel that I got much out of it, I figured someone could point me to something I'm missing/ a way to gain more from the experience. I was not suggesting that I had a better use for my time, simply expressing that the low level of benefit I felt that I got from attending class made me question whether it was a smart use of my time. I was not implying that I was making a choice between either going to class or doing the readings. Not at all. Hope that clears things up.
  6. I hope this doesn't diverge too much from OP's original question, but I'd be really interested to know what people think about using time in class wisely/ getting the most out of class time. I personally found that, despite speaking up and paying attention during most of my classes, I really don't get that much out of it. In fact, after trying a few different note-taking styles, I discovered that I did best in classes where I took very few notes and did most of my learning and studying and reviewing outside the classroom. It really made me question whether going to class was a smart use of my time at all. Did anyone else experience this? What do y'all do to get the most out of being in class?
  7. I'm a U of T student, but FWIW, you should also consider what kinds of law you'd like to practice and what you want to get out of your law school experience in terms of clinics/ other experiences. It seems relatively easy for Ontario students to find summer corporate work at the larger firms in other provinces, for instance. It doesn't seem to me that inter-provincial options are as available in other areas of law. This is based on personal anecdotal "data" though, so be sure to check around. Osgoode has some really great clinical opportunities from what I can tell. I'm not sure what kinds of opportunities there are at UBC, but don't forget to consider those when making your decision.
  8. 2L Summer job reference letter etiquette

    I am asking in person where that's more convenient (given my work hours and the prof's hours), and otherwise asking by email. For the emails, I started with a general message asking if the person would be comfortable/available giving me a reference. Then if they say yes, I follow up with materials.
  9. 2L Summer job reference letter etiquette

    Thank you to everyone who has responded! I'm feeling much less weird about approaching people for these letters To follow up re @ProfReader's post: do students typically send you a list of all the places they need a reference for and just ask for you to write a generic recommendation that suits all of them? I kind of thought as a rule that I ought to accompany any reference request with the rest of my app documents for that employer so that the referee would know what to write.
  10. Stuff to Bring to Law School

    A trusty backpack! A suit for job interviews, mooting and maybe hearings/court depending on what kind of clinics you have in 1L A Kettle (don't be tea-less!) A good scarf/coat/earmuffs (before you catch the flu and give it to everyone in your contracts class!) And if you're moving away from friends/family with whom you speak a language other than English: books and podcast/TV recos so you're not rusty when you go home! It's embarrassing!
  11. Reading Comprehension Struggle

    I agree with what easttowest said about interest. When I did RC sections, I found I scored higher when I found the material of the passage inherently interesting to me. This is because I find it easier to focus on what I'm reading when it's not boring. For some reason, this was a huge battle for me to figure out. From what I remember from taking the LSAT over a year ago, I realized that I found the biography passages super boring, but found the rest pretty interesting. When doing RC, I found that I didn't need to use any special techniques for the interesting passages (i.e., I would just read them once and then answer the questions without marking up the page or anything), but that it really helped to note up and highlight the sections that were less interesting. Don't know if this is all that helpful to OP - maybe you've already done this - but try figuring out why you are finding it harder to parse the humanities passages/ which types of passages you specifically struggle with and adopting a different technique especially for those.
  12. Hello! I am applying to some summer jobs for 2L, some of which require reference letters from profs or other legal employers. I have a few questions about the etiquette around asking for and using these, and will be ever grateful for any advice. When asking for a reference, should I send a pre-written letter to the referee to edit/sign on their own, or should I simply list the requirements of the job I'm applying to and write a few points on what they might include? Should I ask them to send me the reference letter so that I can read it before it goes to employers? Or is it more proper for them to send the letters straight to the employers? I've heard mixed answer on this one before. If I'm applying to multiple places that require reference letters, how many letters can I ask for from a single referee before becoming rude? Before coming to law school, I only ever applied to 3-4 jobs at one time, and thus have never needed to think about securing a large number of reference letters at once. This summer, I've planned to apply for about 30 jobs, about half of which require references... I haven't had the time and intellectual spark to charm 15 lawyers yet!
  13. Yep, I'd wager that you're going to want a private space to relax and recharge on your own in between law school and library study sessions. I live in Toronto, so I'll live vicariously through you.
  14. Ask a 3L!

    I found the vibe in my year to be quite positive - people joked around about stress, but not enough for it to be a daily occurrence/ a constant reminder of stress for people who didn't want to think about it. I'm not much of a sharer, but I got the impression that if someone wanted to share their feelings of stress, the response would be superficially supportive. There was very little of "being around people always sharing their shitty mindset." Most people just seemed happy to have been given the opportunity to study at law school, and expressed some concern from time to time about whether the grades they received would help/hurt their job opportunities later. Nothing unexpected or extraordinary there! Note - I'm not a 3L and this is "ask a 3L" so take that as you will
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